Routine Maintenance

[reganfin]

I am coming up on 1000 miles.
My dealer recommends that I bring it in for an oil change and inspection. I wouldn't have a problem with this except they want $250. They claim that in addition to the routine stuff they will download the engine info and send it to Lotus and that this may have some bearing on performance.

Does anyone know if this is correct? Or am I getting a very expensive oil change?

Also, is the oil filter the same as the stock celica gts?

[Miguel]

There some information in a previous thread

Service costs?

This is what I found out about the break out:

Labor (1.90 Hrs) 188.10
Parts 54.71
Misc Chg 19.71
Tax 3.99
Total 266.51

Misc was env charge (dispensing old oil) $10, $2.19 for part supplies, $7.52 for shop supplies

So it seems most of the charge is on Labor, The dealer that serviced his car is also a Lambo and Alpha dealer so Labor cost will vary depending what other cars they service.

You are paying for top of the line mechanics in those places.

[rnorwood01]

Originally posted by reganfin
I am coming up on 1000 miles.
My dealer recommends that I bring it in for an oil change and inspection. I wouldn't have a problem with this except they want $250. They claim that in addition to the routine stuff they will download the engine info and send it to Lotus and that this may have some bearing on performance.

Does anyone know if this is correct? Or am I getting a very expensive oil change?

Also, is the oil filter the same as the stock celica gts?

I would highly recommend dealer service on this. It would save you from voiding the warranty. Lotus big-brothers the first 1000 miles to ensure that you are following the break-in recommendations.

The engine was tuned by Lotus to different specifications than the Celica engine. Using parts intended for a Celica may or may not result in different performance.

If you're spending close to $50k after taxes and registration on a car, this is not an unusual amount to spend on routine service.

[peck]

from what i understand from the service manager at my dealership they need to change the type of oil,not just an oil change...so do they have to flush out the old oil?

[JLSELISE]

I'm sure your service manager is mistaken. The tolerance control and build quality of modern, mass produced motors means that "break-in" oil, or an early oil change are not required to ensure a long and dependable motor life.
On the general subject--I think the most irritating point is that Lotus requires the 1K service to validate the waranty yet they still make the owner pay for it. This is pretty outragous for a car in this price range. My Audi is in the same price range and has similar perfomance out the door, but that price includes a bumper-to-bumper warranty (including wear items like brakes and clutch) and all routine maintenance for 4 years (or 40K miles).

[reganfin]

I still am confused regarding the oil filter. I have gotten conflicting reports from the dealer as to whether the filter is stock Toyota or not. I plan to do my own maint. after the 1 k check up. Does anyone have a line on the parts list for the Elise?

How about the service manual? I have seen CD's w the S1 and S2 manuals on Ebay.

[rnorwood01]

Originally posted by JLSELISE
I'm sure your service manager is mistaken. The tolerance control and build quality of modern, mass produced motors means that "break-in" oil, or an early oil change are not required to ensure a long and dependable motor life.
On the general subject--I think the most irritating point is that Lotus requires the 1K service to validate the waranty yet they still make the owner pay for it. This is pretty outragous for a car in this price range. My Audi is in the same price range and has similar perfomance out the door, but that price includes a bumper-to-bumper warranty (including wear items like brakes and clutch) and all routine maintenance for 4 years (or 40K miles).

Your Audi is:

- Made in much larger numbers
- Has a much lower redline
- Is not as finely tuned
- Is serviced by a much more experienced staff
- Is built by an organization which has a much larger quality control department
- Is not handbuilt

Although the Lotus engine is built by Toyota, it is tuned more specifically and has a fair number of custom parts. Since Lotus specifies a break-in period which includes reduced RPM operation for the first several hundred miles, it is pretty safe to assume that the grade of oil used during break-in just might be quite a bit different than that used later on.

A Lotus Elise is NOT a mass produced car. Once again, the Lotus is more comparable to a Ferrari, not a German taxi cab, and will have service requirements and reliability more similar to a Ferrari, not a German taxi cab.

[rnorwood01]

There's actually a very interesting thread on oil and break-in periods from nearly a year ago now:

Engine Break-in Voodoo

Bear in mind most of the repair guys don't repair Lotuses full-time and they aren't moonlighting as Toyota service reps, so Lotus also wants their engines broken in properly so they don't have to reimburse a Lamborghini repairman $80 an hour to replace someone's engine after waiting for a new engine to be shipped from Hethel.

I can't say that I blame them. We're lucky we probably will not face a lot of the European snafus, like engines that were only developed to run at sea level.

[mapes]

Lotus Tech Rep, Dave Simkin (sp?) presented some good info at the recent LOG24:

- Factory fill is mineral (better for break-in)oil NOT synth
- Switch to synthetic oil at the first oil change
- 5W40 Texaco Havoline is the oil & weight recommended by Lotus

[Larry]

Morwood,
You wrote: "Although the Lotus engine is built by Toyota, it is tuned more specifically and has a fair number of custom parts."
From everything I've read, other than the cam cover and exhaust system, the only significant change is the electronic controls. I do agree that it's going to see more revs, have to deal with greater acceleration, braking and cornering forces, but my understanding is that the stock motor is pretty robust and didn't need any upgrading. But then I've only read the magazines, press releases and a big picture book on the history and development of the Elise.

[rnorwood01]

Originally posted by Larry
Morwood,
You wrote: "Although the Lotus engine is built by Toyota, it is tuned more specifically and has a fair number of custom parts."
From everything I've read, other than the cam cover and exhaust system, the only significant change is the electronic controls. I do agree that it's going to see more revs, have to deal with greater acceleration, braking and cornering forces, but my understanding is that the stock motor is pretty robust and didn't need any upgrading. But then I've only read the magazines, press releases and a big picture book on the history and development of the Elise.

Which history did you read? There was one that was recommended to me, but it wasn't the one I read. I read the one that I think was by Alistair Clemens.

My other question - are the engines shipped from Toyota whole?

I'm sort of wondering if Lotus is expecting the average Elise owner to use their engines more than the average Celica owner.

Who is this morwood guy anyway :-)

[mapes]

Originally posted by rnorwood01
My other question - are the engines shipped from Toyota whole?

Yes. As mentioned the only changes are exhaust and black box related. I believe we get the closer ratio gearbox from the UK Celica.

[Nick]

Just a small point - the motor is made by Yamaha for Toyota.

[Moondog]

How difficult is an oil and filter change?
Where is the filter located, and how difficult is it to replace? Where is the drain plug?
Is there a renewable drain plug washer?
Is the drain plug magnetic?

[khamai]

Moondog,

Visit the GGLC (Golden Gate Lotus Club) website - www.gglotus.org.

Go to the "Tech" section and then to list of "Elise" tech articles. There's an article there that describes the 1K service (that includes the oil change). There's a few good pics of the oil plug & filter location.

Lotus recommends replacing the oil plug seal/washer everytime. Standard non-mag plug.

Kiyoshi
GGLC webguy